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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.04 00:15:00 -
[1]
Nice graphs indeed. What i also think would be interesting is normalized graphs where the dps of the blaster is subtracted from laser dps. So the negative value shows the area where blaster have the advantage and positive value for laser.
That would clearly illustrate the narrow envelope of range and transversal speed, where blasters is at advantage vs pulse lasers.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.04 17:40:00 -
[2]
I made some graphs to illustrate the difference in performance envelope between blasters and pulse lasers. In the graphs i compare standardized damage output of a Megathron with full rack of Neutron Blaster Cannon II vs an Armageddon with a full rack of Mega Pulse Lasers II.
The target is a Drake with 3xLSE + 3x shield rigs IE sig radius 406.
I compare with all skills at level 5.
Note that the graphs shows the envelope where either ship does more damage than the other. White areas is where both ships do equal damage. Also note that the colors does not indicate absolute damage but the difference in damage output.
This graph shows best short range faction ammo IE Caldari Navy Antimatter and Amarr Navy Multifrequency. The white border between the two colored areas is where both ships have equal damage output. The left colored area shows advantage for the Megathron and the right shows the advantage for the Armageddon.
This graph compares Null with Scorch. Note that Huge difference in advantage:
I also made a graph where i compare Null with Amarr Navy Multifrequency. The advantage here is for the Armageddon. The Megathron does some more damage at range due to greater falloff and also have a small advantage in close range/high transversal. Its just scratching the paintjob though.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.04 18:27:00 -
[3]
Originally by: kyrieee Nice
If you're using MatLab, try: shading interp;
(to get rid of the grid, you can add a less dense one later if you want)
and if you get glitches from the origin try:
lighting phong;
Yes, i used MatLab. I should have removed the grid but I'm too lazy to upload the images again
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.04 19:20:00 -
[4]
To sum up what can be deduced from the graphs:
ANMF have null completely covered. The advantage for the Megathron is strictly inside 10km. Nothing new there..
So the old question is if the advantage of the Megathron inside of 10km is large enough to compensate for the ability to, without delay, project damage out to 50 km.
What my first graph illustrate is that the advantage of the Megathron inside of 10 km is rather small. Only in the high transversal area does the Mega significantly more damage.
On the other hand, if there is a high probability that the Megathron can keep the target inside of web range for the duration of the fight, then the range advantage of the Armageddon is moot.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.05 00:34:00 -
[5]
Originally by: ropnes Edited by: ropnes on 05/10/2009 00:11:45 Geddon also has a 25% DPS bonus you know And I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'vastly superior'
I don't think he means the Mega vs Geddon comparison but some of the graphs early in this thread.
What else to say about people who by their own admission base their opinion on game balance matters, not solely on the state of the game itself, but also who they think is trolling the forum? It sounds a little juvenile to me.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.05 14:13:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Jack Icegaard on 05/10/2009 14:15:27
Originally by: Roemy Schneider graphs etc..
Funny, did you say trolling? In your first post you ramble about how the OP have skewed the comparison to make blaster look bad and how that affected your opinion in this subject.
Then you present your own graphs which are pretty much a schoolbook example of biased argumentation.
You can find any number of ship vs ship situations where one ship will have a huge advantage due to the ability to take advantage of weaker resist. Such comparison have very little bearing on the balance of the involved weapon systems.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.05 14:29:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Jack Icegaard on 05/10/2009 14:31:04
Originally by: Roemy Schneider Edited by: Roemy Schneider on 05/10/2009 14:27:57 i have no idea what you're talking about. could you be any cloudier?
maybe an example perhaps, plz.
do you want me to use other lenses, ones with more thm damage but lower dps? other drones? i can do all that. is it the nano platings? feel free to mention any two setups
Find a ship with a large hole in explosive resist. Match it vs a artillery BS at sufficient range. Use the matchup to demonstrate the awesomeness of artillery turrets.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.05 14:57:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Roemy Schneider does it have to be good ole' doomsday proof?
The idea I'm trying to convey here is that if you want to factor in resist you have to demonstrate that one type of damage is preferable over another for a very broad spectra of probable targets. Only in that context is the resistance relevant for balance.
Arguing in detail about specific match ups and fittings is futile. Note that the Drake i used was solely for the purpose of the sig radius.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.05 16:31:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Sinderblock
Originally by: Jack Icegaard Edited by: Jack Icegaard on 05/10/2009 14:31:04
Originally by: Roemy Schneider Edited by: Roemy Schneider on 05/10/2009 14:27:57 i have no idea what you're talking about. could you be any cloudier?
maybe an example perhaps, plz.
do you want me to use other lenses, ones with more thm damage but lower dps? other drones? i can do all that. is it the nano platings? feel free to mention any two setups
Find a ship with a large hole in explosive resist. Match it vs a artillery BS at sufficient range. Use the matchup to demonstrate the awesomeness of artillery turrets.
Maybe I'm confused but the standard armor resist package is 2x EANM, and 1xDCU II right? Thrm Kin will always be better to shoot at armor tanks then EM Thrm (except for perhaps gallente t1 resists) and most battleships field armor tanks its not like she picked some kind of special case or something, blasters hit better resist holes vs armor tanks it is just a fact.
If we restrict the discussion to pure BS vs BS i would say you most definitely have a point. I think this thread is more about the performance envelope of blasters and pulse lasers in a broad perspective.
About resists. Have you noted the trend to slap LSEs on just about anything. Hurricanes, Brutixes (Brutix is plural?) and even Harbingers are spotted with LSEs these days. Then we have all the Hacs and recons with LSEs etc. All those ships are important parts of a balanced nutrition for a battleship.
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Jack Icegaard
The Omega Project
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Posted - 2009.10.05 16:40:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Jack Icegaard on 05/10/2009 16:41:31
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
ah so you're saying you want blaster to be the one ship to pwn them all...?
Clearly, I'm the guy who have to explain to Bilbo why he needs to let go of his precious.
You cant find one post where i state that blaster needs a boost or that PL needs to be nerfed. Heck, Im training pulse lasers like anybody else :)
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